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New Poll Shows New Yorkers Divided on Common Core

But they agree on one thing: delay its implementation.

New York State Education Commissioner Dr. John King fielded angry questions and comments at a Common Core forum on Long Island in 2013.
New York State Education Commissioner Dr. John King fielded angry questions and comments at a Common Core forum on Long Island in 2013.
New Yorkers disagree about whether the State Education Department's new learning standards are too demanding or whether they properly prepare students for college or career. But they agree about one thing: the state's rollout of Common Core should be pushed back.

A poll released today by Sienna College revealed by a 50-38 percent margin, respondents want implementation of Common Core standards delayed for two years.

Opinions were more mixed on how demanding the standards actually are, with 23 percent saying they're just right, 24 percent saying they're not demanding enough and 36 percent saying they're too demanding. 

Also mixed were opinions on how well the standards do their purported job: orienting instruction and learning to prep students for college or work after graduation from high school. While 46 percent of respondents are confident, 45 percent are not. 

“As the controversy around the Common Core and its implementation continues to swirl among politicians, education advocates, parents, and teachers, New York voters remain divided on whether or not the new standards are too demanding, and whether or not those standards will better prepare students for college or the workplace after graduation,” said Siena College pollster Steven Greenberg. “Even as the debate over the Common Core rages on, New Yorkers’ attitudes about the Common Core have changed very little over the last three months.”

Parents and educators across the state have blasted the State Education Department and Education Commissioner John King over Common Core and the collection of student data. Politicians have also joined the fray.

The state Board of Regents made changes earlier this month, delaying full implementation of all the new standards until 2022.

BELIEVER IN JESUS! February 25, 2014 at 10:14 PM
Oblumbercore! It's communism! It's part of agenda 21! It's the dumbing down of America. Notice the only ones that are for it are communist liberals! There are a lot more intelligent people then "they" anticipated!
My Taxes Are Too Damn High February 25, 2014 at 10:31 PM
The erosion of State's rights continues under this administration
Bob Zahm February 25, 2014 at 11:15 PM
@Elise - being able identify different parts of speech, being able to parse sentences, etc. is a reasonable outcome for all students completing MS / entering HS. Why someone would criticize this requirement when it used to be the standard for all effective schools is beyond me. But the key point is that this is an outcome definition and not a definition of how to teach students about the different parts of speech.
Allison White February 26, 2014 at 08:45 AM
STOP the New York State Education Department (NYSED) from sharing confidential information without parental consent and violating the privacy rights of students and parents. Sign petition here http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/protect-new-york-state
GLENN February 26, 2014 at 09:47 AM
AGENDA 21
Carol February 26, 2014 at 10:30 AM
NYS has had well-developed standards for over a decade. The fact that our city and state decided to spend millions to billions of dollars to change over made no sense to me. If anything our standards could use some tweaking because too many concepts are taught throughout the year making retention harder for our students unlike Asian countries that put more concentrated effort into a few major concepts a year. They teach and mile deep instead of a mile wide. I don't believe this poll is correct because we are finding many of the topics and lessons especially for our youngest students not age appropriate. What Common Core has done is line the pockets of testing companies like Pearson, and the man that developed it was never an educator but a pawn of Michelle Rhee. I also know even though it wasn't reported in the media, that the Common Core was a contentious item at the last White House Governor's Conference. Many governors like Cuomo who is seeking re-election is now coming out against the haphazard way this was introduced, especially giving a high-stakes tests using Common Core last year when in many cities it was yet to be implemented. We all know grades plummeted, yet he still insists teachers be evaluated on these same scores. Our biggest concern should also be Cuomo's insistence that we be part of a Gate's experiment to sell private confidential data to a company called inBloom. This is more than just test scores, it's a student's whole profile and is being done with the right of a parent to opt out.
Theresa Flora February 26, 2014 at 10:52 AM
In the unlikely event CC is completely rolled back here in NY, do you think public education will be magically cured of its ills? Where has everyone been for all these decades while public education was taken over by the Left? Where was everyone when bloated budgets passed year after year? There's a list a mile long of deep-rooted problems with public education, including the thuggish unions, for starters. I don't worry about curriculum as much as I worry about indoctrination, which has long preceded CC.
Chris Albanese February 26, 2014 at 11:09 AM
I have not worked in the schools in over 8 years and I remember this being implemented way back then, so this is not a new concept. Either a kid knows their stuff or doesn't. Testing only proves that he/she can test well and many brilliant people are horrible under pressure. When the parents and teachers base their whole academic careers on one lousy test in the 3rd grade, of course the kids tend to do poorly. We used to get tested once a week in my school. You took the pre-test before the material to see where you were, an interim test to make sure you were grasping the concepts and a post test to make sure you've mastered the material before moving on. Testing is a required tool of educators but not the be all end all. That's just so the politicians and administrators can either puff out their chests and show how well THEY are doing or make excuses for how poorly the STUDENTS are doing. Ever notice that politicians, administrators and parents never fail an exam??? As mentioned by some posters, this is all a conspiracy to teach to the lowest common denominator or "dumb down the US" and in the process line the pockets of the companies that produce the tests, texts and all of the ancillary industries (i.e. Teacher's College, the producers of the "manipulatives", etc). Just think about it, most school districts are in dire financial positions, but a huge chunk of their budget is spent on books and materials that they don't need and have no place to store all because if they don't use every penny in their budget, they may not get the same amount in future years. How many times have we heard "we took a huge budget reduction this year, we only got a 3% increase instead of the 10% we're accustomed to so we have to cut programs." As a former school budget manager, one of my schools literally had a room in the basement to handle the overflow. Long time teachers already had their classroom libraries filled to capacity. What a waste.
eatingdogfood February 26, 2014 at 01:07 PM
BUST UP THE UNIONS! They are not the least bit concerned with students, just teachers, and themselves. If you really want to see some change for the better in public schools, try getting rid of the union.
matthew simpson February 26, 2014 at 06:55 PM
Holy Angels RA in patchogue had a 90% pass rate. Public education is not fixable better off letting the market work and get the government out of educating our kids. why dont other states have these issues ????
Elsie February 26, 2014 at 07:54 PM
I did not find that Holy Angels administered the CCSS assessments. They are not posted on the website. Your reasoning is skewed - a private school is free to not accept students who have educational or behavioral needs.
Elsie February 26, 2014 at 08:06 PM
OK - I found it. I don't know that you can really draw any conclusions based on the sample size. Holy Angels in Patchogue Meeting 4th grade ELA - 24 students tested 75% passed Meeting 8th Grade ELA - 27 students tested 59.2% passed Meeting 6th Grade ELA - 42 students tested 52.4% passed Meeting 4th grade Math - 24 students tested 45.8% passed Meeting 6th Grade Math - 42 students tested 11.9% passed Meeting 8th Grade Math- 27 students tested 3.7% passed
Scooter February 27, 2014 at 07:30 AM
It's time to write a letter to your schools superintendent telling them your "decision to remove our son/daughter from Common Core testing" . The State has forgotten that elementary school should be enjoyable for our kids and that art, music, and gym are just as important to their growth as math.
New Guy February 27, 2014 at 01:22 PM
How does subsidizing someone's medical and pension educate a child? The Government run school system tells the Assessor's office how much they need to operate, that is why the assessment is set later. Why are we as hardworking taxpayers giving people medical and pensions?
Chris Albanese February 27, 2014 at 01:41 PM
New guy, the argument has always been that to attract the best and brightest people to the teaching profession, you had to offer generous compensation packages other than salary because as we all know, teachers make next to nothing. Decades ago, this led to the unions negotiating the 4 hour work day (6 classroom periods of 35-40 minutes including a "prep"), 5 day work week, 180 "teaching" days out of the year as opposed to the usual 240 work days for most other people (365 days - Sat/Sun - 10 vacation days - 10 holidays). Anything over that = OT or Per Session. So a teacher making $30k is really making the equivalent of $40k and they can work the summer for additional pay. For comparison, a starting accountant is working a minimum of 40 hours/week for about $32-35k. Let's not lose sight of the lifers (20+ years)who make in excess of $100k <sometimes more than the administrators>. Once someone has been there that long, good luck trying to get them removed from the classroom. Again, I know this as a fact from my time as a SBM as well as my wife, sister, cousin and several friends having been teachers. I get how hard it is and many of them really care about the kids and bring work home with them. <grading papers on the beach> Unfortunately, there's no way to legislate that or reward them without rewarding everyone.
Theresa Flora February 27, 2014 at 05:14 PM
People are worried about CC & data mining. But they're just part of the long list of offenses that've made this country unrecognizable. Public education is beyond repair, and I'm thinking this country may be also. We shall see what the midterms bring. If only the GOP were true to its roots.
Elsie February 28, 2014 at 07:43 PM
Professional developer modeling a CC lesson. This is in Chicago, but the modules in NY are set up the same way: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/wp/2014/02/28/a-video-that-shows-why-teachers-are-going-out-of-their-minds/
Harold1968 March 03, 2014 at 04:55 PM
Teachers don't want to be held accountable for the teaching, or lack of teaching, they provide. They're getting parents all riled up so CC is delayed and eventually killed. The teachers I know personally don't care about their students. They became teachers to work nine months of the year, get six figure salaries with two annual raises, retire in their 50's with $100,000+ annual pensions and free healthcare for life. Wake up taxpayers! We pay higher and higher taxes for teacher compensation while our kids fail miserably compared to the rest of the world. Bad teachers need to be fired without years of litigation, teachers need to teach our children at least 210 days each year, they need to retire at 67 like we do, they need to be switched to 401K plans like the rest of us, they need to pay for their own healthcare and get one annual raise based on inflation. Wake up New York, you're getting ripped off by the teachers union and the politicians they own.
Bob Zahm March 04, 2014 at 08:31 AM
@Harold1968 - so you think highly educated people who are responsible for our kids day in and day out, teaching them what society expects them to know to be able to contribute and take care of themselves are overpaid? Did you know that the average salary - in NY - for a teacher is more around $65k than $100k+? Maybe you live on Long Island or Westchester and hang out with experienced teachers who do have a chance of getting to $120-$130k / year. But that's far from normal. And, as to the working until 67 suggestion, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want that from most teachers because the energy and enthusiasm required to work with kids tends to wane with the passage of years. Think you , as a 60+ year old, would be able to keep up with 25 5 or 6 or 7 or 8 year olds? Probably not.
Harold1968 March 04, 2014 at 10:08 AM
RyeBob, I do live in Westchester. Teachers have more than a "chance" of being paid 120K+. You can check yourself using the "SeethroughNY" website. I noticed you didn't comment on pensions, healthcare, raises and job security. How do you think they compare to the average taxpayer?
Bob Zahm March 04, 2014 at 11:16 AM
@Harold1968 - the amount teachers are paid is not the problem. living in Westchester, you should certainly be aware of how inflated all local costs are. crossing the tappen zee cuts gas prices by 40cents a gallon in response to another one of your copied posts, I made clear that job security (tenure) needs to change to a renewable / reviewable model, but that has little to do with the common core. in posts on other threads - not to you - and in letters to NYS Gov, Sen, Rep as well as in other forums, I have made the case for the need to convert to a defined contribution model from the current defined benefit model. Again, this has nothing to do with common core, but needs to be fixed.
Harold1968 March 04, 2014 at 11:35 AM
RyeBob, It looks like we're on the same page with tenure and a defined contribution plan.
mark March 05, 2014 at 06:21 AM
theres a few problems with schools 1. The teacher/student ratio is too low, teachers need to be able to teach to classes of 30 2. Too many kids who dont belong in school, either illegal and then those just not smart enough who belong in trade schools 3. the ridiculous amounts of money spent on teams, fields and coaches
Bob Zahm March 05, 2014 at 06:56 PM
@Mark - couple of questions. First, on what do you base your assertion that the appropriate class size is 30:1? There's lots and lots of validated research showing that there are two clear cutoffs in teaching impact as enrollment is increased; one is around 12:1 and the next is around 22:1. 30:1 would make things cheaper in terms of salary but negatively affect teacher effectiveness, particularly for elementary and middle school. Second, what is the basis for asserting ridiculous amounts are expended on school oriented sports? For my district, it's about 1% of spending. That too much?
Elsie March 08, 2014 at 09:54 AM
Mark - be aware that the student:teacher ration has nothing to do with class size. Part of that ration includes art, music, phys. ed., librarians, social workers, speech teachers, special ed teachers, psychologists, RTI teachers, reading specialists, math teachers. To use a school in my grandchildren's district as an example. They have 530 students and 18 k-5 classrooms for an average class size of 29 which is VERY high. They also have 3 inclusion special ed teachers, a psychologist, social worker, music teacher, librarian, gym teacher, art teacher, speech teacher, reading teacher, 3 RTI teachers and who knows what else. So now their class size is reported as: 16 students per teacher. More goes on in a school than just general education classrooms.
Truthhurts March 11, 2014 at 10:47 AM
There is no diversity a much larger percentage are STRONGLY AGAINST THE WHOLE PROGRAM.
NYCLU LHV March 19, 2014 at 03:44 PM
We will be holding a free public forum on our students' right to learn. Among the topics to be discussed will be about the Common Core. Please join us at the Greenburgh Public Library on March 25 at 6:30 PM. Thank you, lowerhudsonvalley@nyclu.org
Commack Resident March 21, 2014 at 11:02 AM
My son is a top student in 4th grade. He easily passed the new Common Core State ELA and Math tests last year. This year, he is NOT taking them. I have no doubt he would "pass" again, but, really, is there any real value to passing a meaningless test? He consistently earns top scores on all classroom exams. He reads at an 8th grade level. He has nothing to prove, and I will not allow my 9 year old child to sit through more than 12 hours of tests to prove what we already know...he can read, write and do math at, at least, a 4th grade level. It is not kids like my son that I am concerned about. Other children are the ones hurt most by these tests. Like the little boy we know, who is one of the best math students in his grade, yet gets pulled from the classroom to attend mandatory remedial math instruction because of poor performance on last year's state tests. No one- not his parents, his teacher, or the remedial instructor-thinks this boy needs remedial instruction. Yet, it is mandatory because of a poorly written, ambiguous exam, that failed to test the concepts that the children were taught in the classroom. Many, many students are in similar situations. I am not against standardized tests in general. I allowed my son to take them last year and he performed well. Now that I realize how utterly meaningless the state tests are in their current form, and also just how many hours these poor little children are forced to sit through to take them, I am vehemently opposed to them. We have notified the school, in advance, of our decision to refuse the tests this year. I urge all parents to do the same. We will continue to refuse the tests every year, until the subject matter being tested actually has a real relationship to what the kids are being taught in the classroom, and until the 12 hour-long evaluation is reduced to a more reasonable length, one that 8 and 9 year olds can actually be expected to sit still and concentrate for.
Aidan April 11, 2014 at 10:04 PM
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2014/03/17/how-common-core-standards-kill-creative-teaching
Case closed April 23, 2014 at 08:01 PM
Parents are being told to attend tutoring for common core so they may help their children. If the wheel ain't broke Stop trying to fix it. Case closed

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